Interchanging parts between guns

Hi All

As you probably know I have a 1936 A5 12GA standard, that is a regular shooter. My local RFD has offered me another complete action which I was planning to purchase for spares, but its a slightly later model. The one notable difference is that the safety is the newer type with the crossbolt push button at the rear of the trigger guard, however mine has the classic "suicide safety". I was just wondering how interchangeable the parts would be, I guess I would be unable to use the whole trigger assembly as my carrier spring is receiver mounted and its going to trigger plate mounted on this version.

What do you think is it worth buying for spares or should I wait until one of the same vintage shows up?

(Sorry RFD is registered firearms dealer in the UK!)

I believe 1958 was the year that FN made some significant changes in the Auto-5. To me, the biggest change was the thicker rail on the Locking Block. As you know, the thin rail types are prone to breaking. If you have an older gun with a broken rail you've got two choices, find a used part, or replace BOTH the Locking Block and Bolt with new parts. According to Art, the thicker rail solved the Locking Block problem but now the bolts tend to crack. The good news is that the newer parts will fit your gun.

As for the Trigger Plate, I think the newer one will fit. If so, that's good news because the receiver-mounted Carrier Springs are just about unobtainable here in the U.S. and all parts seem to be an expensive nightmare to get in Europe. I spent an enjoyable afternoon modifying and fitting a Remington Model 11 spring to one of my 16's but I don't think that option is available to you. The new springs can be made to work on the old guns, according to the FSM, but it seems a little Rube Goldberg to me. (If I'd known that then, I could have spared myself all the "enjoyment".)

I don't consider the safety on your gun to be the "Suicide" type. A safety in the front of the trigger guard is familiar to millions of U.S. and even some British servicemen from the M1 Garand and M14 rifles. The prototype and first year production Auto-5's had the safety entirely inside the trigger guard, requiring the shooter to put his finger in there to turn it on. Dangerous by today's standards, the "Keep your finger out of the trigger guard until you're ready to shoot" maxim wasn't around until fairly recently. Yours can be operated without violating that rule. The trigger guard safety was used from 1904 to 1951, possibly a little longer for World Market guns.

Here's a look at a real "Suicide Safety".


So, to finally answer your question, if the receiver is a good deal, consider it. If the Trigger Plate fits, I'm pretty sure you can remove whichever Carrier Spring you want and the gun will function. If the plate doesn't fit, all of the parts except the Trigger, Carrier Spring, and Safely will interchange. The Trigger Spring may require some fitting. The Bolt and Locking Block should drop in also.

In America, we call such guns cobbled together from parts "Frankensteins".

Well I bought the receiver for 40 pounds just waiting for it to be delivered!

How much is 40 Pounds in US dollars now days...?

About 57 US a good deal I think for a complete receiver minus stock and forearm. I'll strip it for spares to keep my 1936 A5 going when needed.

Better than a good deal -- a Great Deal. It's funny, spare parts are impossibly expensive in Europe, but parts GUNS are ridiculously cheap.

Please keep us informed as to what fits, and what doesn't. If the new receiver has Speed Load, you'll definitely want to add it.

It had to have the mag tube and front of the receiver "chopped off" in order to qualify as spares only and not entered into my licence. Yeh I know us Brits have some strange gun laws! anyway it looks tidy from the picture.

Early 1958, it may or may not have the new bolt/locking block an carrier spring. It should have speed load.

Hi Rudolph31, thanks for the info I guess you managed to date it from the serial on the stock tang? I am hoping this does have the newer block and latch as that would be a really useful spare part for my A5, to be honest I dont find the older one piece carrier (ie. non speedload) that much of a disadvantage so wont be too worried if doesnt have this.

Will let you know when it finally arrives.

Yes, the serial number is stamped on many parts, including the tang. Speaking of which, you won't be able to use that trigger plate unless you find another butt stock. I just noticed the tang isn't curved -- it's a rare one made for a straight stock.

I'll strip it down for spares!

Well the "donor" A5 action I bought for 40 UK Pounds (57 USD) arrived yesterday and I got busy stripping it down last night. It was in good condition and my A5 screwdriver set from Brownells made light work of getting it in bits. Its an interesting action and seems to be a bit of a transition model as according to Rudolph31 it was dated early 1958. It has "some" of newer features such as speedload, crossbolt safety but had an action mounted carrier spring and screws instead of roll pins for the shell stop etc. I was really after a good locking block with the single rail (old type) but unfortunately the LB on this gun is totally worn, there is really no rail left at all on it yet the gun dealer said it had been a shooter so I wonder how well it would have worked in this condition, any ideas??

I really like the trigger group and given that it has the carrier spring in the action it should drop straight into mine, although as R31 pointed out the tang may be unsuitable for my stock. Thats a shame as I was considering adding speedload and the new trigger group to upgrade my A5 as I like a crossbolt safety but it may need a straight stock (i dont like straight butt stocks!).

So I still need to find a good old type locking block for my spares box, now that I have a really good stock of spare parts it would be good to find someone to trade with!

Here is a pic of the stripped down trigger plate and tang

You know that You still can use the speedload parts without the new trigger assembly right?

Yep Kumpe I do indeed realise that. To be honest I dont really have a big requirement for speedload as I use the gun for mainly hunting either in a hide or field and loading it before is not an issue. Its good to have the parts in stock though should I ever decide I need them!

Thanks

Well I tried to install the speedload feature (2 piece carrier) into my Auto-5. I followed the FSM to the letter and replaced the carrier itself, carrier spring and locking block latch and spring. All parts were taken from the donor gun which had these installed. However it didnt work, when I put it all back together the bolt could not be pulled back rearwards, it was jammed in the forward position. I dont know why this is so I reverted the change and put back all of the original parts.. It worked fine after that.

All I can assume is that the parts needed additional fitting as they were not new, I also suspect something with the carrier dog as it looks a bit worn on the 2 piece carrier.

Shame really but I'll leave it as is for now and keep the parts in my spares box...

When the bolt was stuck, did the bolt handle move at all when you tried to pull it back?

Hi Kumpe

No not all...

It was jammed solid.

Off the top of my head the only thing I can think of that can cause the bolt and bolt handle to jam that way would be some kind of unlikely binding in the action spring and/or link assembly, or that the firing pin was stuck in the "fired position" for some reason. My first thoughts were that the locking block latch would somehow be the culprit since you replaced it, but after looking at my gun and my spare bolt assembly, I can think of no way that it could cause something like this.
AFAIK the carrier dog is not engaged at all until the bolt has been opened almost completely so that doesn't sound likely to me.
Since you got the original pieces back in there, I can only assume that the bolt came loose somehow when you took the gun apart, but at what point?

My guess is the pin that holds the locking block latch was either in too far or not in far enough. Either way it jams the bolt tight.

Thanks guys.

Well I am going to leave it for now, I dont want to keep pulling it apart and messing with it. The new carrier spring has resolved the issue I had with the carrier sticking in the up position and to be honest I dont NEED speedload..

So I'll keep all the parts for the future or if someone needs them..