Hi Can anyone tell me anything about my newly purchased B25 , It is Serial # 48696 S5 and is a lovey gun, I wondered if it was c2ss or simply a B25 sideplate, I had been searching for a B25 for a long time and this one I think was worth waiting for. Thanks Alan
Beautiful shotgun. I'm not a Superposed expert, but I can tell you that S5 is a 1965 12 gauge Super. http://www.nramuseum.org/media/940941/serialization-date of manufacture.pdf
Beautiful gun, did you buy it in the States or overseas? Who signed the engraving? I will do some research in my Schwing book. Thanks for the pics.
Nice M2 - Congratulations, Alan! I can tell you it was listed with Chris Potter in Kent a couple months ago. Check your 'conversations' for other comments. In the meantime, I would appreciate knowing what the reference to 'c2ss' is. To establish when the gun was built, it would help to know who the engraver was/is. I did not see a signature under the game scenes, so it is probably signed on the bottom tang near the trigger. Engravers working at the SC then were Bleus, Ernst, Purgal, Pirotte, Perfido, Baerten (Jose and Claudy), Dewill, Lewanczyk, Diet, Bailly, and Poes. I suspect this is either by Jeanine Perfido or Sophie Purgal.......2 female engravers sent directly from heaven. Even though #48696 S5 suggests a 1965 date of manufacture, it is more likely a 1975 DoM from the FN Custom Shop. The main reason is the FN M2 engraving pattern was not a standard FN pattern until the 70's. Serial Number 48696 is in the numerical sequence for manufacture in either 1965 or 1975. The S5 gauge/year code could also apply to either 1965 or 1975. Explanation: I have seen examples where the Custom Shop omitted the '7' from the 2-number year code after its formation in 1971. I believe this was an early attempt to distinguish the guns that were to be engraved in the FN factory from those to be sent to, and engraved at the Custom Shop at 13 Rue Faurieux about 1/4 mile from FN. Some gauge/year codes were omitted entirely from the serial number under the opening lever, but appear on the barrel block......sometimes with a single year code (omitting the decade...i.e., '7') Case in point: I have a 1974 CS (by S. Purgal) gun that omits the gauge code ('S') from the tang serial number, (thus 43xxx 74).......and on the barrel block it has an 'S4' serial number suffix (thus 43xxx S4). Likewise, I have another 1975 CS (also by S. Purgal) gun that has a '76' suffix on the tang - and no gauge code 'S'.......(thus 48xxx 76).......yet on the barrel block, the serial number suffix is 'S5'....(thus 48xxx S5). So, there were obviously some inconsistencies in the 'FN' gauge/year code formats. Fortunately, There are other clues to determine whether YoM was 1965 or 1975? The full address for a 1965 FN would be: "Fabrique Nationale, d'Arms de Guerre - Herstal, Belgique" In 1971 the company changed its name to "Fabrique Nationale - Herstal". The new barrel address for post-1971 guns read - "Fabrique Nationale Herstal - Belgique" If your B25 has a 'BrowninG' barrel address: A 1965 gun will have "Browning Arms Company St Louis & Montreal P.Q." After 1970 (and thru 1976) the barrel address is "Browning Arms Company Morgan Utah & Montreal P.Q." Another way to distinguish (at a glance) between 1965 and 1975 production is the shape of the top tang was changed in 1966 from a 'Y'-tang to a 'U' tang. This was a cost-cutting measure that required less fitting time on the stock in-letting for the 'Y' shaped tang. I would love to know more details about this gun - via 'conversations'. If it is (in fact) a 1965 gun (due to 'tang' and barrel address), then I suspect the upgrade to M2 occurred after 1987. I hope this helps - Lovely piece! 'le petit poisson'
Mr. Littlejohn shared (via 'conversations') that his M2-style side plate has the post-'71 FN-Herstal barrel address, thus 'S5' corresponds with a 1975 date code. He also shared that the gun is signed 'Gironi'. I researched a bit and discovered Luciano Gironi is an engraver in Liege with quite extensive credentials. Among his accolades: Professor of engraving -Léon Mignon, Liège (School of Liege) since 2011 Alumni of Léon Mignon, Liège - Specializing in ornamentation and animal rendering - 1982-1989 Intern with the Engravers Cooperative of Herstal - (existed between 1987 and 1992) Engraver in residence at Francotte Precision - Liegeoise Performed work for: Fabrique Nationale Holland & Holland (among many others primarily in Belgium) He traveled to the US with then Professor of Engraving (Rene Delcour) and spent time with Larry Wilson - famed Colt collector in CT. Then traveled to Tennessee and spent some time with Kurt Horvath (kguns.com) He has collaborated on engraving projects with other notable Belgian engravers such as Lovenberg, Pascal, and Florent. The subjects or theme of 'Fleeing Partridge' (on Alan's M2) seems to be a popular game scene. The most common occurrence I've noticed is on the Beretta and other Italian guns. But I have also seen this motif on a few B25's besides Alan's. I have a '66 FN D4-style live bird gun custom-engraved by C. Creusissi. I know nothing about this engraver but the ornamentation style and name suggests Italian influence. Coincidentally, 9 years later Mme Purgal created a D4-style Exhibition Grade with the same subject matter ('Mallards'- left / 'Fleeing Partridge' - right). Purgal's bottom scene is the FN logo in my avatar - Creusissi's is a landing mallard in a marsh setting). All scenes (except the FN logo) are in Bulino style. I often wonder if both guns were commissioned by the same client, different engravers.......9 years apart. Mme Purgal is retired and living in Belgium. I have lots of questions - very few answers - but a tremendous appreciation for their art and craft. I'm sure Alan will share anything he learns, if he is able to make contact with M. Gironi.
